Taught Not Told Podcast
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Much Love,
Coach Tyler
Taught Not Told Podcast
EP#43: Mark Holman: The Unspoken Truth About Men’s Health & Hormones
In this episode, I interview Mark Holman, a health coach specializing in men's health and hormones, particularly testosterone.
Mark shares his personal journey from being an environmental engineer to becoming a coach, emphasizing the importance of optimizing health and understanding hormonal balance.
The conversation delves into the symptoms of low testosterone, the significance of blood work, lifestyle changes, and natural supplements that can aid in boosting testosterone levels.
Mark also discusses the nuances of testosterone replacement therapy and the importance of individualized health approaches.
The episode concludes with fringe tips for hormonal health and the importance of paying attention to one's body signals.
Join us on this journey to understand and improve men’s health, and don’t forget to like, subscribe, and share your thoughts in the comments below!
You can find Mark on Instagram here:
https://www.instagram.com/markholmanhealth
You can learn more about Mark and his coaching services here:
https://go.markholmanfitness.com/unchainedbrochure
In This Video We Cover:
00:00 Intro: Mark Holman
10:24 Symptoms and Testing for Low Testosterone
15:52 The Importance of Getting Tested
19:11 Optimal Ranges for Testosterone
31:22 Major Disruptors of Testosterone
35:04 Lesser-Known Disruptors and Taking Action
39:44 Natural Supplements for Testosterone Support
42:08 Herbs for Testosterone Boosting
48:58 Testosterone-Boosting Foods
53:28 Fringe Practices and Individualized Approaches
01:04:15 Bio Individuality Regulation
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Hope you found this helpful!
Much love,
Coach Tyler🤍
Welcome back to the Taught Not Told podcast. Today I have an extremely exciting episode. I got my friend, mark Holman, who I met from another mentorship. That is an amazing coach and also has amazing knowledge around health and hormones, specifically testosterone, the male hormone and I'm super excited to dive in. And, so being said, my man, mark, I would love for you to introduce yourself and ultimately give us a little rundown of your story and what ultimately got you into coaching man. I'm glad to be here.
Speaker 2:My name is Mark Mark Holman Been in the health industry, coaching for full time for about like four and a half years now. So coming up on five, which is a major milestone. What I do, I coach men. I help men optimize their health hormones, energy levels, confidence, all that stuff. And really how I got into this I'll try and keep it brief Can be a long story as much time as you need. Yeah, essentially I know what it's like to be in the depths of despair, to be at rock bottom, to not have good health, to lack confidence, lack self-esteem and be stuck in a job that I hate, it, that you hate.
Speaker 2:So to go back to give you context, backstory, I actually have an engineering degree. I got a degree in environmental engineering and right after that I worked as an environmental engineer. Well, not really as an environmental engineer, but as more of a chemical engineer, working for industry, for oil refineries, chemical plants, and the whole reason why I got into environmental engineering was for sustainability. But I was actually working for the polluters to help them fall in line with the regulations, to allow them to pollute more and, essentially, make more money. So it was a direct conflict in values. That with the whole nine to five lifestyle cubicle isolated, I was living in a one bedroom apartment, just really lonely, just not having a.
Speaker 2:It was a direct conflict in values that, with the whole nine to five lifestyle cubicle isolated, I was living in a one bedroom apartment, just like really lonely, just not having a good life. And I did that for about three years and eventually got fed up with it. Throughout the whole time I was like this can't be what life is like. There has to be something else. There has to be something more for me, because this just sucks, and it wasn't until and throughout this whole time. I'm getting into fitness, getting really into lifting, nutrition and all that stuff, but I wasn't quite able to get the exact result that I wanted. I was making decent progress, but not quite what I wanted. So I ended up hiring my own coach, and this is our mutual mentor, jeremy.
Speaker 1:That's how I met him.
Speaker 2:I was an OG fitness client and he really just like exploded my brain as to what's possible. I didn't even know that entrepreneurship was a possible path for me, but I got exposed to him how he ran his business. It seemed pretty simple. You get leads through word of mouth or social media and then you coach them with your knowledge and it's just like we were doing email check-ins back in the day. So it was super cut and dry, super simple, and I was like I could definitely do something like this. So that was a seed that got planted. And then I think I worked with him in maybe 2016, 2017.
Speaker 2:And then it wasn't until 2018 that I finally got up the courage to quit my job. I traveled through Europe for two months. I went to Costa Rica to visit some friends and then I came back and really just like put the work in on the path. It was majorly humbling. I went from being an engineer and having that salary to essentially working as a it was called fitness staff, but you're essentially a janitor. You'd wipe up, sweat, you'd clean towels, you'd pick up towels from the locker room at the jewish community center. So very humbling experience, but it was what I needed to do to put myself in the place where I needed to be in a gym making connections. I was studying for my personal training certification, got that, and so from that janitor job I that worked up to working at a restaurant to also two gyms as a personal trainer. So really grinding and then trying to build this online business on the side, but not really having enough bandwidth time and not putting enough energy into it. And then this gets us towards 2020. We all know what happened that Gyms get shut down, restaurants get shut down. So I was faced with a decision Do I want to just dick around, pick up unemployment, or do I really want to change my life, go all in on myself and build this business that I've wanted to for ever since I started working with Jeremy, and so I did that. I put 9K on a credit card for a mentorship to teach me how to create a business, and I did that, and that was April 2020. And now it's September 2024.
Speaker 2:So, four and a half years later, it's been a constant evolution.
Speaker 2:I started with just fitness, but it's constantly evolved more like things like journaling, meditation, adding that in there and then getting really into holistic health, learning how to analyze blood work and coming up with protocols based on blood work and then to now really niching down on men and then connecting back to, like, my experience of just being lonely, depressed, not where my health needed to be, low testosterone, all those things. As I was working with people, I just felt more and more called to work with men just to help with this. You know it's, it's hard to be a man in today's society. I mean, it's hard to be a woman as well, but there are unique problems that both sexes come up against and I just feel called to really help men go on similar paths that I went on of just being like in the depths of despair to coming out and doing that through optimal health, through optimal hormone levels, and also there's a mindset and mental aspect of things as well. But yeah, that's the long and short of it.
Speaker 1:Dude. That is quite an amazing story and it's actually kind of funny. I do relate to you with the engineering thing. I guess I dropped out of it sooner than you, in a sense where I started my first two years of college I went as a mechanical engineering major. My first two years of college I went as a mechanical engineering major and, as I was doing all my classes, all of my free time was dedicated to working out. I was playing soccer in college, but I also was like working out full time. All I was doing is listening to fitness podcasts. All I was doing on my computer when I wasn't doing homework was studying fitness and health, and I was so fascinated by it so I ended up changing my major to kinesiology and fell in love with it, man, so I could definitely relate to you.
Speaker 1:In the early stages of that journey of all of our focus was really on like the numbers of, like the workouts, the statistics of like oh, am I getting my steps and calories. And I really love to hear that. You know coaches, especially the great coaches that I know, go from just the numbers and the, the those data points, to really taking a step back and really seeing that there's so much of a bigger picture going on, like how you mentioned the journaling, the meditation and how those things that inner work, that other, those other things really play a role in the fitness journey. I think a lot of people kind of ignore those things or don't really include those things, and I really see those as signs of a great coach is when you actually are not only talking about those things but integrating those things with your clients as well. So that's fantastic to hear, man, and thank you for sharing.
Speaker 1:So I think, going into that, I see that from your content. I know, with the mentorship that we're part of, I know you definitely are involved with that in terms of helping other people in that mentorship with hormones, and I know your specialties to self-serve and I also know that you're not one to shy away from investing in yourself and your knowledge. So I would like to know is like where have you found most of your knowledge when it comes to testosterone? I know I think you recently went on a trip to to learn more about testosterone. So you know what, what has ultimately been like the, the main source of a lot of the things that you've been learning about, testosterone or maybe and what are some of the like really interesting and amazing findings you've had over, say, the last few years now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so the biggest place that I've learned pretty much all of the deeper holistic health stuff is from a mentorship called the Institute of Health. It's my mentor, jake Carter. He's over in Australia and they're really, in my opinion, running like the best health mentorship for coaches, for health coaches in my opinion, running like the best health mentorship for coaches, for health coaches. The amount of due diligence that he puts into the modules and then also the research to create the modules is ridiculous. And that trip that I went on was to meet up with him and learn. He was doing a seminar in Amsterdam and it wasn't just on testosterone but it was on blood work, advanced functional blood work analysis, and so I was really exposed to the depths that he goes to find the optimal ranges and then from that you can extrapolate like this is where the optimal like marker lies and and because of like, if it's high, there's like these specific outcomes that are either death or disease or whatever, and then below same type of things, and like how being high or low correlates with specific things like nutrient deficiencies or mineral deficiencies, like that. So that's where I've learned a lot of what I talk about in and what I teach. And then, further than that, like that's a that kind of opened my eyes to what's out there.
Speaker 2:But there's also like individual study. That I do is going through these studies, learning how to look at specific studies and then analyze, extrapolate what that means and then apply it to real life. So that's what I did. I did that for like the eight hour plane ride back home, just diving into PubMed of, like this is the specific thing that I will want to look into. Like testosterone and let's say, fenugreek. Like what are the specific thing that I will want to look into? Like testosterone and let's say fenugreek? Like what do the studies say? How much can it boost? What do you need? How do you need it standardized to get the right outcome?
Speaker 2:So, to wrap that up, it's like I invested myself in this mentorship and then also there's always continual education on my end to look at the latest research, to look at good research, to then extrapolate that and then they use that with clients, which is the third thing, is like the experiential learning. All this theory and all the studies are great. That gives you a place to start. But then if you're not implementing it, or if you are implementing it and possibly not getting results like maybe with the specific people that you work with, maybe it doesn't work, or there's always an aspect of bio-individuality, the N equals one. That I think is the biggest teacher of having the back and forth of like let's start here with this foundational thing Does it work, does it not? And then from that, learning and and fine-tuning your approach based on that Absolutely and kind of diving into that too.
Speaker 1:Man, I feel like just understanding testosterone to begin with, especially people who will be diving into this or listening to this and being like what the hell is testosterone? I think it would be great if you could kind of give me and the listeners a possible breakdown. What would be the symptoms of quote-unquote low testosterone? As I know from my understanding, when it comes to high, low and good or normal testosterone, there's such a big range and recently I've had a few clients get their hormone testes and they're like, oh, you're normal, but really they're on the the cusp of like what doctors call normal and he doesn't feel great. But I'm curious to know, when you have a client or someone that you're talking to and they're like, oh, I think I might have low testosterone, what are some of the symptoms that are come as a result of low testosterone?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So low energy is going to be a big one, and we'll just talk about specifically men right now. So low energy, low libido, either not being able to put on muscle or even losing muscle, workouts just not the same kind of suck. No drive and motivation to do things to like excel. So you think about dopamine, of like going out, achieving, not really having that. Testosterone and dopamine are pretty heavily correlated.
Speaker 2:Just feeling lethargic the most general way I can put it it's what makes a man a man, and so if you're feeling less of a man, then that's where you should look. You should definitely look into testosterone levels and it's funny you bring up the ranges. I literally made a post about that today. The ranges are anywhere from depends on the lab, but like 200 to 900. And you can have 850 and you're considered normal, or you could be 250 and you're considered normal. They're both treated the same exact way, but the person who's 250 is likely struggling really bad, and not just from the physical stuff that I mentioned. It's also mentally Depression, anxiety, lack of focus, lack of confidence, self-esteem. All of these things are impacted by testosterone as well. So it's really important to have in a good range.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. And the most important thing from my understanding is really just like quality of life, and I don't think people have the wherewithal to really take that step back and really think into like, oh man, I didn't realize. But yeah, I have had a lack of motivation, have had a lack of drive. I probably should get my hormones tested and it's crazy because a lot of people I feel like would benefit from. Generally speaking, it's a lot of lifestyle factors that contribute to testosterone and I just find it so interesting because I've also heard multiple people and multiple stories from other people saying like I'm at like a four or 500 and I feel perfectly fine, and then there's people that are in the six 700 range. They're like I feel horrible. So is there some truth in that? Is there an individual variance of where people sometimes like on the lower end can feel great and feel normal and then people on the higher end that don't necessarily feel great?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I really love this conversation. It's with anything there's always nuance, right? So for the person, let's just go through each of those scenarios and I'll explain my thoughts. So for the person who's fairly higher 700s that's only looking at total testosterone and that's a good marker to look at. But you also have to look at free testosterone, because free testosterone is actually what your body can use. So your total can be really high.
Speaker 2:But if something called SHBG or your estrogen or prolactin are very high as well, your free is going to be low. You're not going to feel the effects of testosterone because it's just not being used in your body. So that's a possible scenario for that guy. And then also there could be other dysfunctions going on in the body that are creating issues. So like you might have high testosterone but maybe your adrenals are fucked. But usually if your adrenals are fucked, your testosterone isn't going to be, is going to be hindered. So there's some play with that back and forth. Usually if we see some health handbrakes going on, dysfunctions elsewhere, they're going to trickle in hormones. But I would definitely look at the free testosterone conversation before and then going to the guy who's a little bit on the lower end but feels great like his free. Same thing His free could be high because his SHBG is in range, not high prolactin his estrogen is fine.
Speaker 2:So it's also about the. It's not just about the number, it's about the ratios and the relationship with everything within the body and how that's all interacting. And there is also an aspect of bio-individuality with everything interacting. And there is also an aspect of bio-individuality with everything. Some people might feel fine, they might feel good at a lower number. Their baseline might just be 500 and that's like their sweet spot. And possibly going above that, maybe their body just doesn't or that's not what they need. They wouldn't really feel a difference. And so that's where it comes back to that thing that I was saying. Like the n equals one like. There's always an aspect of that. Everyone is like look at, if you were to look or google all of the different like chemical reactions that occur in the human body, it's astronomical how much so there's got to be variance between the people based on like. Do they have the substrates, their genetics, all these different things? So yeah, hopefully that answers your question.
Speaker 1:That was a beautiful answer and I really think the nuances in themselves definitely make it more challenging to navigate this for the general population and to really kind of get a full grasp on. Like, am I good, am I bad, or should I just ignore this? Or is this something I really need to pay attention to? And so I have two questions on that topic, which would be how do I know when I should get tested? Is it something where I should just start my journey 100% by doing this? Or, if I'm lacking the motivation, start my journey 100% by doing this? Or if I'm lacking the motivation I'm stressed all the time, my energy's low, I don't have any drive should I get tested? Or should I try to improve my lifestyle, my habits? Then, if that's still not improving, then get tested to see where I'm at. I'm curious to know what your perspective is on that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a good question. So there's always multiple paths you can go, but we'll break it into two, so let's say you don't. Well, let me back up when you should get your blood work done. I think it's always a good time to do that, because the more clarity you have around what's going on inside of you, the better and the more educated your approach can be. So, for me, every client that I get, we start with blood work because it just gives us so much specificity in the approach. They may not even be dealing with a major health handbrake, but our specificity and the level that we can improve is much more targeted. So our efforts are very specific and time isn't wasted. So if you're fine with like I wouldn't say wasting, but like possibly not getting results in the six months that you're changing things, then you can go about that. But if you want to be really like targeted, really specific with what you want to do, then I think blood work and getting it analyzed by someone who knows what they're doing is a good step.
Speaker 2:Caveat to that, though, you should always be improving your lifestyle, improving your nutrition. All of these things like that should always be a baseline. So it's kind of both like definitely at the same time that you want to get these tested, that you're experiencing some of these symptoms, and you aren't addressing lifestyle. Like bro, it's obvious, like change some of your lifestyle. Like look into your sleep, look into nutrition. If you're not working out, like definitely get into the gym and start training. Then from that, like, you can get a little bit more specific if you want to.
Speaker 2:And then the approach changes because there's also this you know out in the fitness world, in nutrition, there's all these diets right, there's vegan, corn of carnivore, paleo. It can be confusing, and so what eliminates confusion is clarity. Through blood work you get clarity. So you see, okay, what is the right diet framework for me, what is the right macronutrient split? So, if you have low stomach acid and you go crazy high protein, you might create some digestive issues. So with the blood work, you get a much better idea of like, okay, where should your fats be, where should your protein be, where should your carbs be? And then your approach is just more specific to you. And so you know that you have the right plan for you and you're not just pulling from an influencer here, influencer here and just like mashing things together. Yeah, that's like a surefire way that you're not going to get the best results, in my opinion 100%.
Speaker 1:That was a fantastic answer. I really like this man. I'm really enjoying this. I'm learning a lot, so thank you, I think one of my next things is really like when it comes to the hormones, I know we did talk about a little bit of the nuances, how everyone's a little different.
Speaker 1:Everyone has a range and an area of which I will feel best in this range. You're going to feel best in this range, he is going to feel best in this range. So my question is I know you've been doing a lot more research, I know you've been traveling a lot. I know you just got back from that conference, like you mentioned too.
Speaker 1:Now, when it comes to the average healthy person, I really feel like the range is so broad and so big so it can account for the general population who is generally overweight and, like 75% of our population's overweight, 50% is obese, right, it's like these numbers are so astronomical now, so they have to like throw that in. Well, when we're talking about someone who's healthy and fit, someone that takes care of their health, what are the major hormones or markers they should pay attention to? So I know you've mentioned testosterone, fetus testosterone. What would be like two to four that they should really pay attention to and, in your opinion, with working with hundreds of people, what are some of the ranges or what would be a good number to shoot for in terms of like feeling and looking your best, generally speaking, I know, obviously, like I said, it's going to be different for everyone, but generally speaking, yeah, no, that's a good question.
Speaker 2:Uh. So definitely, like on the hormone side, free and total testosterone are going to be good to look at. Going more broad, let's look at liver enzymes. So there's ALT, AST and ALP, One of the big things that's becoming more and more. I actually saw a statistic 18% of teenagers have fatty liver, which is wild, and so obviously a lot more adults have that and this is just like a it's metabolic disease essentially. So, seeing more and more of fatty liver in the general population, we're expecting liver enzymes to be elevated.
Speaker 2:Ggt as well is one to look into. So that's four for liver, Just. I mean, that's a good place to look. In general, it's just like has the liver, because the liver just does so much, especially with you know you can say it helps detox and all the toxins that we're exposed to on a day-to-day basis is pretty high. So we want to make sure that that system is functioning properly and if there's fatty liver, that's definitely something to address. So that's the liver. I would look at blood glucose. You know this is one that we could look into. Diabetes is at an all time high. Type two prediabetes I think that was like at either 50 percent of people are either type two or prediabetes.
Speaker 1:Even in children. I've seen statistics showing how prediabetes and diabetes in children is on the rise, which is equal. Crazier to see.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's wild, but blood glucose would be a good one because that shows what's your blood sugar like and if it's super high, then there's some metabolic issues. Type 2 diabetes is essentially very high blood glucose. So, looking at blood glucose, hba1c and insulin those three for blood sugar, health and a1c is essentially your 90-day blood sugar, so it's a little bit longer term. Instead of just like a snapshot, it gives you a 90-day, which is valuable information, and then insulin and blood sugar. Those two go hand in hand. If both are high, h a1c is high, glucose is high, insulin is high. That's definitely something to address because diabetes is not good, highly inflammatory. There's tons of different issues that come with that. So those would be like two areas to look at.
Speaker 2:I'll talk about cholesterol in the sense of I'm not that fussed about cholesterol being high. Everyone, from doctors, everyone's been scared about good, bad cholesterol, but it's kind of a myth. If we look at LDL, there's been studies that have been done and this is actually crazy to me that the reference ranges on labs include zero. If you had zero, they'd be like, yeah, you're fine, but that's insane to not have any LDL, because cholesterol is actually an antioxidant. It's actually good. It is a precursor to testosterone, so we actually need it. But based on, like the flawed science and the flawed studies that they did a while back, just cholesterol and LDL got demonized. But getting back to the study, it actually showed that lower, like, there's groups, so like tertials, they're thirds, thirds or fourths, and they found that the lower thirds and fourths with LDL and cholesterol were actually at a higher risk of dying from all cause mortality. So this is literally any type of death disease whatever. Compared to the people they weren't in the highest tertial, but maybe, let's say, the top 70% to 80%. So high, high cholesterol.
Speaker 2:But that's where there was the lowest cause of all-cause mortality and this study was done over a very large population. So it's a good study. It's not just like this random thing that was done on five rats in a laboratory. It's very large, robust, statistically significant, so it's definitely something to be looked at. But then here's another thing the lag between this type of research and medical practice is ridiculous. I think it's around 17 years Going to a doctor and getting their advice. It's so outdated that you're not getting the best information that you can possibly get. And that's where coaches like you and me we come in and we have a lot more opportunity. We're not within this system, the medical system. We have a little bit more freedom to utilize peer-reviewed research to our advantage, and not just from our medical school background, like spew, what we were taught, that's been being taught for the past like 50 years 100% man.
Speaker 1:And going back to what I was saying about testosterone and free testosterone, because here's the thing I'm not exactly sure. I haven't gotten my intestine in a long time, which, by the way, I feel like it'd be really cool if I could have you back on and maybe say six months or so, if not sooner, if I could go get mind tested and then you could just rip me apart and I feel, like that'd be kind of cool to share with the audience.
Speaker 1:So if you're watching this, in whatever platform, shoot me a message or comment and let me know if that would be something you'd be interested in. There's Mark ripping me a message or comment and let me know if that would be something to be interested in. There's mark ripping me a new one of my hormone levels. But, that being said, I know like, generally speaking, people could probably go to their general practitioner and request a hormone test. Um, I'm not sure how many different markers they include in that, and so I'm curious what would you recommend when it comes to testing? Would Would you recommend they go to their doctor? Would you recommend using a third-party lab, or do you have a company you work with specifically, just out of curiosity?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so it kind of depends on your doctor. Some people have really cool doctors that are up with the times and they'll get them whatever test they want. Others not so much, and you really have to pull their arm and specifically to get testosterone tested even just like total and not free you have to go in there and tell them that you have ED erectile dysfunction or they won't even think about it. So there's definitely that Depends on your doctor, but I don't even mess around with that, I just go third party. There's a website called Merrick Health, m-a-r-r-e-k healthcom. That's where I send all my clients. I got a code, mark Coleman, 10% off your order. I don't get any commission, but 10% on blood work definitely helps and usually the panel that I recommend it comes around 250 bucks, which is really not bad.
Speaker 2:I've looked at so many different companies and Merrick has been the cheapest, most affordable and just the experiences is really good and you can literally go on the website and order exactly what you want and I've got a. I've got a panel I can send people if they want. After they listen to this, they can just message me or you or whatever, and I can share with them of like how exactly to to create the panel. Um, but yeah, I would definitely go third party because it's just a headache to to deal with your doctor and they're, if you can tell them like, I want a comprehensive panel, it's not going to be comprehensive enough, like that's from my experience. For some reason they gatekeep these blood tests. I really don't know why?
Speaker 1:Because awareness of your hormones hurts them from making money on us being sick, which is a crazy statement to make, but it's absolutely factual.
Speaker 1:I'm sure we could go down a lot of rabbit holes and into the deep darkness that comes from I know, like how you touched on cholesterol and pharma, possibly being involved in that realm, and definitely too many things that I've took too much time diving into, to be honest. But we'll stay, we'll keep save those ones for another time. But I'm kind of going back to what I was mentioning about the testosterone or free testosterone, because I feel like most people who end up getting a blood test or testosterone test, they really might be curious of like, okay, maybe they have a path, so when they can take a peek at, or they have a doctor's visit coming up and they're going to ask what would be that ideal range, that sweet spot that you've seen in a majority of your clients or the general population to be like, is it around a 600? Is it around a 700 for testosterone? And what would be that number for free test that you would say like that's a pretty good one for, generally speaking again, I know the nuances, yeah, of course.
Speaker 2:So my optimal ranges for total testosterone is 700 to 900. And you know 700 is. We'll just say 700 is the lower limit, because if you're above 900, I'm not freaking out either, I'm actually impressed. So 700 is the lower limit for total. Three is a little bit interesting because different labs use different tests and so I've seen, I've seen some be like closer to 300 and then, and that being like optimal, and then the other test is like it's more in the single digits, so that one's a little bit more nuanced. But if it's, and it's like, you have to understand which one you get, because you could be in the single digits but the optimal range is 300. So like looking at the units, looking at the actual test, what are they normally measured?
Speaker 1:Is it like nanograms per deciliter?
Speaker 2:So yeah, total testosterone is nanograms per deciliter. Free me check. Don't remember free units off the top of my head.
Speaker 1:Those are. Those units always kind of confuse me and I've always been like, okay, I have an idea, I just know the numbers, but I don't necessarily know what those units always mean. That wasn't always my specialty.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so total is nanograms per deciliter in the US, it's different in the UK and elsewhere. And then free is picograms per milliliter, and so the range, what I've seen, the normal range, would be like anywhere from like five to 20 or so, and so I usually like it like 11,. 11 to 20 is usually a little bit sweeter, yeah.
Speaker 1:That's super helpful, man, thank you. Thank you for sharing that, and I know, like I said, and just if you're listening to this, know that everyone's different, everyone's range is going to be a little different of where you feel your best, but I was curious to know like a general range. So that was helpful. Thank you for sharing that. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think. I think, if you like, it's not just looking at the numbers, like you have to merge subjective and objective. So blood work can be objective but, like, subjective is how do you feel, what symptoms are you experiencing? Correlating all that together? So like, whenever anyone comes into my program, they get the blood work but they also get this very extensive screening form that talks about a bunch of different systems, questions, symptoms, all that stuff. So it's merging those two together to get a really clear picture of what is exactly going on.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. Couldn't agree more with that, and I think that applies to pretty much every aspect of the fitness and health journey in itself as well. And I think, going into the symptoms of being low testosterone, I think commonly, like we talked about the energy, the mood, the stress, anxiety, the lack of drive. Now, either someone is realizing right now, dang, I really do have those symptoms and I should probably get my testosterone checked, or they're in a place where, like, I really don't have the financial means to go get my testosterone checked, but I really do want to start making the right decisions to move this in the right direction, assuming my testosterone is low. Number one what are the biggest disruptors to testosterone that are causing people to have low testosterone? And then, what are some of the lesser known disruptors that people should avoid or start avoiding, even though some of them have been in their lives for a very long time?
Speaker 2:Yeah, no good question.
Speaker 2:So the big ones, the biggest rocks we can move sleep. Even if it's just one night of bad sleep, your testosterone can drop by like 30%. So ensuring that you have, and so think about that. Chronically it's tanking. If you're sleep apnea, insomnia, just not getting good sleep, your testosterone is going to be on the floor. So sleep is paramount to really dial in and optimize.
Speaker 2:Stress is another one. So it's really the basics. The big ones are really the basics, like optimizing your sleep and your stress management with work. And then you're training seven days a week, super hard, high volume, high frequency, high intensity, like everything is high. You're going to doing more harm than good, and so that's another thing. The nuance with training, like training lifting weights very good for testosterone, but there's a balance, right. If you overdo it, if you're training too hard, overtraining or rather lack of recovering, you're gonna have your hormones are gonna be on the floor. So those are definitely the biggest one. And then, like, there's obviously nutrition, like make sure you're eating a nutrient-dense diet, you're not eating processed food, all this bullshit. Those are, those are the biggest things that you can really start to change.
Speaker 2:And, yeah, getting into the lesser known ones. I always like to talk about plastics. So this might be, this might be like lesser known, but kind of getting into the more more known these days because it's becoming more and more spoken about plastics using plastics. So this is, like you know, the classic meal prep you put your food in the plastic, you microwave it, that plastic's leaching into the food you're eating, that it's getting into your bloodstream, wrecking your hormones. You know just every source of plastic, even the clothes that you wear polyester.
Speaker 2:This is probably a lesser known one yeah, everybody just end up with their shirts off at the end of the podcast.
Speaker 2:Polyester it's actually plastic. You know they, you you'll see them talk about how their clothing is made from recycled plastic and it's created polyester and you're like, oh, recycled plastic, that's great. But then you think about it. Our skin is our largest organ. It's absorbing whatever is like touching it, and so if it's plastic rubbing up against it throughout the whole day, you're absorbing some of that. If you even go further down, you think about our underwear polyester underwear.
Speaker 2:There's actually studies that show that polyester underwear is a contraceptive which is wild. It is reversible, so if you stop wearing it, you'll get the fertility back. But fertility and testosterone and health are very correlated. So if we see something stopping our fertility, we know that it's definitely not going to be healthy for us. So opting for natural fibers organic cotton is my favorite wool stuff like that, especially if you're a man and you're using polyester underwear I would stop that immediately and start to replace your wardrobe there. Further, air pollution is one that's maybe not talked about too much, depending on where you live. If you live in a city, if it's a fairly polluted area, air pollution can kind of wreak havoc on the hormones, and so simply just getting an air filter in your home, where you spend the most time.
Speaker 1:Do you have a recommendation on air filter?
Speaker 2:by the way, I haven't looked at them for a while, but I think Air Doctor is a really good one yeah that's usually I've heard about that here yeah, and you like, if you can only afford one, like where do you spend the most time? Probably sleeping, so putting it in your bedroom is going to help with sleep quality, stuff like that. Or if you're a high performer, maybe in your office. You spend more time in your office than you sleep. Um, true, yeah, now that I'm thinking about it, I was like I probably spend more time in my office.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, um, yeah, those are the. Those would be the lesser known ones on that side of things, for sure man dude.
Speaker 1:I always find this topic extremely fascinating because there are so many things looking back to my childhood of like, wow, I really did not pay any attention to this, Obviously. I mean, I was eating Hot Pockets for lunch, bro. I'd come home from school, pop one of those things in the microwave. You know it's like but, now I'm like shit dude.
Speaker 1:I probably did so much damage. Thankfully, I'm in a much better place At least I feel so place, at least I feel so. One of the other things that I've heard thrown around and I've heard from on other podcasts is, like this term called forever chemicals Kind of these things that you'll find in plastics is one big one. But I also know like also people's products that they put in their hair or on their skin and lotions, and is there any truth behind that? And are there companies and or products that you'd recommend to avoid and or to be smarter or spend a little more money when purchasing?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a really good one as well. All these chemicals are endocrine disrupting chemicals, which endocrine system is hormones, so it just gets in there and disrupts hormone production. Things like, yeah, the personal care products, cleaning products, is going to be a big one, like cleaning sprays, bleach, things like that Colognes as well. Something that I learned, maybe a few like five years ago possibly, is the word fragrance. If that's on a cleaning product or like a cologne or anything, that can literally be a conglomeration of like a thousand different chemicals and all they have to do is just put fragrance. It's kind of like a loophole and it's, you know, to get this the perfect scent. There's probably a lot of stuff, random stuff, that's going in there to get this a lot of different chemicals, but they can just call it fragrance and then so it's like oh, it's just, it's just this, this and fragrance. But what is the fragrance? It's kind of like a protected term that no one really knows what it is. So that was like a kind of tidbit that I learned.
Speaker 2:And yeah, like colognes, deodorants even this isn't necessarily from forever chemicals, but deodorants with aluminum. That's a heavy metal that's getting into your bloodstream and you know it's. It's kind of funny like it stops you from sweating. But sweating is how we detox and so you're like stopping the detox process with something that's like a heavy metal. It's just kind of bonkers to me, but people don't want to be sweating, be stanky, but there's definitely like workarounds, like you can get aluminum free deodorant. Schmitz is a really good brand that I've been using for a long time All natural.
Speaker 1:I was literally going to ask you a brand, because I know a lot of people like oh, like the aluminum free ones ones, they just come off and they get all over my clothes or they don't actually work. So I'll definitely have to try that brand. I have another one that I use. I can't even remember the name off the top of my head, but yeah, I've tested six different ones until I found one where I was like, okay, this one actually works good, it has no bad chemicals or anything in it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, schmitz for deodorant and then cleaning products products. Branch basics is a really good brand. Um, dr bronner's is really good for soap, like I use that for for body wash, and then also they have like a cleaning, cleaning spray or cleaning soap as well. Those are, those are pretty simple. I use dr bronner's for a lot of things amazing that was fantastic.
Speaker 1:Now that someone's recognized okay, I have the lotus offstone, I'm gonna start fixing my. They've already been making those better habits in their lifestyle. They're like okay, I've realized that the biggest disruptor for them was sleep. They got that on track. They got through away all their underwear, bought all new cotton, 100% cotton, the high quality stuff. Now they're rocketing and rolling in the right direction. Maybe they're still noticing like hey, I'm still not optimized, I'm still not where I want to be in terms of my testosterone levels or my symptoms. Obviously, there's a plethora of things that could be involved in this, but I'm curious are there any on one end natural supplements, foods and or alternative supplements that would be recommended for someone that is trying to say, boost testosterone or encourage more product, more testosterone production?
Speaker 2:yeah, um, there definitely is the like. Testosterone boosting supplements do work, but there's a caveat in the sense of is it what you actually need? So this is like. This is the point where I'd be like 100, don't waste any of your time and money and effort. Get your blood done. Get your blood tested so we can really see what exactly is going on. So we're not like trying this supplement and then this supplement, and then this supplement and then not getting results and you're like pissed. You're like, oh, like I tried all this stuff but it's like we didn't know that you needed it or didn't need it. So getting blood tests a hundred percent at this point, yes. That being said, I'm just going to assume that this person is deficient in everything that I talk about. So they're going to get the boost.
Speaker 2:So zinc is a big one. Zinc is actually required for luteinizing hormone, which is essentially what tells our balls to create testosterone. So if you're deficient in zinc, you're going to be suffering from slightly lowered testosterone levels because your body's just not working as optimally as possible. Same thing with vitamin D. There's a study done, I think it was around 18% increase when supplemented with vitamin D, and this is people with deficient vitamin D, which is a large portion of the population. The majority of bloods that I see are vitamin D deficient, and this is not just on the normal ranges but also the optimal ranges, which is all a lot tighter. We'd want your vitamin D to be a lot higher. Zinc vitamin D we can look at like the thyroid is very important too. So ensuring selenium is adequate Less studies on selenium than zinc and vitamin D.
Speaker 2:Zinc and vitamin D are like the staples in terms of nutrients. Magnesium as well is going to be good. Most people are deficient in magnesium just because of the soil, the foods. It's kind of hard to get a lot of magnesium from food, so that's going to be a good supplement that might give you an edge. That's nutrients.
Speaker 2:So in terms of like herbs, tongkat Ali is really a popular one these days. Huberman talked about it and made it famous. I'm a big fan of that. It helps with mediating stress. It helps with lowering SHBG, which we talked about, which can increase free testosterone, so you'll get that benefit. Can also possibly like help stimulate luteinizing hormone as well. So that one's. I love that one.
Speaker 2:But the thing here as well, with any of these supplements, you want to make sure that you're getting a high quality supplement, and the thing with these herbs is they need to be like. If you look at the study, the study is done on the specific like active ingredient to a certain standardization. So you have to make sure that the product that you're getting is one dosed correctly and two standardized adequately, so you're getting what you need for that effect that they saw in the study. There's so many brands out there that don't do this and they just are selling this product based on hype. They say it's got Tongkat Ali and you're like oh, I heard on Hube and Tongkat Ali works. And you're like you buy it, it, but you don't get the result because the product sucks. That's a big thing that I see and I do like these, these tea booster product like myth bus, I guess and just kind of tear them apart, because a lot of them are doing this. They're using proprietary blends which, if you don't know what that is, it's essentially like pixie dust.
Speaker 1:They're all the ingredients. They're like just a little bit of this, a little bit of that yeah, yeah, they're.
Speaker 2:They like it's 200 milligrams of like 10 different things. So you're probably not even getting like one milligram of something. But it has tonkat, it has tribulus, it has fenugreek. So you're like, oh, those are all known test boosters. This product's amazing, but the proprietary blend, it's not standardized, it's at too insignificant of a dose. So you're wasting, wasting your money and unfortunately I see that a lot with this, the tea booster industry and stuff. And, that being said, like there are good products out there. You just have to find them. You just have to know what to look for. And if they have a proprietary blend, like, just turn around, throw it away. I don't trust that because they're not transparent. If a brand isn't transparent, you know I don't trust you. So that's a really good filter to look through if you're looking for supplements and products. That was a quick tangent, but we'll come back.
Speaker 2:Tomcat Fidoja Agressis has been talked about again by Heberman. That's decent. I don't really use that as much. There is some toxicity possibilities if you take it longer term and the dose is pretty high. So I steer away from that.
Speaker 2:Fenugreek, like I talked about, I think it's like prostaglandins, is like the specific. I might be butchering that that might be something else. No, it's something else. It's proto-cidin or something like that. It doesn't matter. But same things. Standardize the like. Actual active ingredient in fenugreek needs to be standardized.
Speaker 2:Tribulus works for some people. That's something that you need. A fairly high dose, like around 900. And a lot of these products they throw tribulus in there and it's 200 and you're just not going to get an effect. Let's see, those are definitely the heavy hitters For free testosterone. So when SHBG is high you can use something like boron to help lower SHBG. That one's kind of you have to take that strategically because if you take it for too long it can raise estrogen. So boron is what I use for people who have high SHB engine and then low estrogen. That's perfect for them. I really love boron and then stinging nettle root as well is going to help lower SHBG. Free up that free testosterone. Those are definitely the heavy hitters. You're doing good if you're finding a product and it has those, or you're like specifically seeking those out, ideally after you get your blood work done and you're like, oh, my free was low, my shpg was high, my estrogen is low. Mark said boron's good for that, I'm gonna go with boron.
Speaker 1:That is fantastic, and I know there's probably going to be a couple knuckleheads on here listening that are like, oh, I'm just gonna just going to go buy all these supplements.
Speaker 1:So, number one, I need to make sure I advise that if you are doing this first, you are doing yourself a disservice and you're literally just putting a bandaid on a really big, gaping wound and it's not going to do anything for you long term. You might feel good for a week or two and hopefully Mark can back me up on that one, but ultimately I do 100% agree. I think going as natural as you can and going through the lifestyle things where most people are messing up is going to be the most important thing. And then, once you've tested, once you find out what's really I feel like correct me if I'm wrong, but I feel like one of the best ways to really optimize your health is really, once you have all the micronutrient levels tested, all of those things, and building a supplement protocol that is very specific to what you're deficient in. That alone can not just your testosterone, but just your general quality of life and health could make significant impacts. Would you agree with that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, 100%, and this is actually what I do with my clients as well. They all come in. They track their food for the first seven days and beyond, but the first seven days we're using an app called Cronometer and it actually tracks micronutrients as well. So from that we get their weekly nutrients and we can see. You know, this is how they've been eating. They're deficient in this, this and this, and so maybe it's from that we're like, okay, start eating these foods that are high in these nutrients that you're deficient in. Or if it's something like magnesium, possibly vitamin E or vitamin A Vitamin A is a little bit easier, but vitamin E, then you know, strategically targeted supplementation there is going to really help you get that specific nutrient filled and just feel way better 100%.
Speaker 1:And just before I forget, I do want to dive into foods, but just so, if someone is trying to do some research. They've done a lot of these things. Again, they did all the prerequisites. Is there a brand that you typically like when it comes to the supplements, whether it's the nutrients or the, the Tongkat Ali, for example? Is there a brand?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I don't have any affiliation or anything. But the brand that I really like is Now Foods and the reason why I like them third party tested. They're very transparent. They do studies on other products and they always come back as like, what is what they say is in there is actually in there. Now Foods is really good. They don't have everything, but what I like for more like on the herby side is Nootropics Depot Same thing third party tested Like I trust that company a lot, so those would be my top two that company a lot, so those would be my top two now foods for like nutrients and then nootropic depot for some of the more fringy stuff Beautiful.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much for sharing that. And to kind of dive into foods, uh, I'm curious are there testosterone boosting foods or foods that seem to be more, say, anabolic in a sense of that, are going to be best for our testosterone foods that we should regularly include into our diet if we are looking to enhance or maintain healthy testosterone levels?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so what comes to mind first is pomegranate. They've done studies on pomegranate increasing testosterone by I want to say 18 in the teens teens to low 20s. But you'd have to look and look into that, that's one, I think it's I think it's pomegranate juice, if I, if I remember correctly.
Speaker 2:But again, it's like really high quality stuff. It's not the concentrate, so that's that's one that that could be cool. I really like and this is kind of weird, but you get a lot of benefits from it is eating pomegranate like a, like an orange, so like you're not eating the outer skin but you're eating the pith inside, which is like kind of kind of bitter, but there's tons of benefits there. Like pomegranate is a mod biotic, which is it's selectively antimicrobial, so it'll help proliferate good bacteria in the gut but but also kill bad bacteria in the gut. It's super cool. So pomegranate.
Speaker 1:Blew my mind, bro yeah.
Speaker 2:That is so cool, I had no idea. That is one.
Speaker 1:I've never heard of. I feel like I try to keep up to date with this stuff, and that's actually one that literally just blew my mind. I had no idea about that.
Speaker 2:Hell yeah. So yeah, pomegranate's good After that. It's just like making sure you're eating nutrient dense foods. So like grass fed liver is going to be really good. Tons of vitamin A, copper, zinc in that is going to be really beneficial. People talk about oysters because it's just super high in zinc, a highly bioavailable zinc as well. Those are going to be good ones, ensuring that you have adequate fat intake as well. Like hormones, they need fats to be created Cholesterol as well. So making sure that you're getting adequate fats, like omega-3s. Salmon, wild caught, you know, your grass-fed steak, grass-fed beef, that type of things. Eggs yeah, eggs as well.
Speaker 1:The thing about eggs Got the cholesterol and fat right. Yeah, yes, no, I was just gonna say yeah, don't make me stop eating eggs.
Speaker 2:No, no, eggs are cool. Eggs are cool, you're good. The one thing I will, though, will say is some people can be sensitive to eggs. It is kind of high on the, it can be high in histamine, and if you have gut issues, eating eggs might not be the best for you. I actually experienced that. I was like eating scrambled eggs every day and I was like just my stomach was wrecked and it was just not a fun time, and then I was like, oh, it's probably the eggs, and I stopped eating eggs and I was fine. So I like it's.
Speaker 2:It's a high on the allergen list, so that's my only caveat on eggs. Like this is my the thing the gripe that I have with like influencers that just like promote a specific food or diet. It's like, yeah, it's a good food, it's very nutrient, dense, but there has to be like a nuance of caveat, of like it might you know, only if you digest it well. Same thing with dairy. I'm a fan of dairy. I do well with dairy. Some people do better with raw dairy, which is something to try out, but if you're lactose intolerant, like dairy isn't going to boost your testosterone at all. It's going to make you feel like shit, 100%, 100%.
Speaker 1:I will say eggs. I've noticed a big difference going from normal store-bought eggs even if you buy the really good ones, versus farm-fresh, farmer's market high-quality eggs. The yolks just look completely different, but also I feel so much better eating those versus Costco eggs or just normal store-bought eggs. It's dramatic difference.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I actually did like a mini experiment comparing the Costco. They call them pasture-raised. And then I went over to Whole Foods and I got the Vital Farms pasture-raised and they look completely different. The Costco was like way more yellow, which is like less nutrient, and then the Vital Farms which is a good brand they were. It was way more orange and I was like that's interesting. I don't trust Costco brand stuff anymore.
Speaker 1:I know right, it's kind of a trip. Wow, dude, I'm still kind of shocked on the pomegranate thing. I am. I'm gonna start eating those way more often, man, yeah, wow, I've honestly learned so much today. This is phenomenal.
Speaker 1:I'm pretty blown away by your depth of knowledge on this topic and I know for a fact a lot of people are going to get some value out of listening to this.
Speaker 1:And, like I said, man, honestly, one of the biggest things that I feel like I want to take to the next level with my clients and my business, I feel like, is that realm of hormones. I just had a lady on last week where we talked about a lot of the female cycle and the female hormones, and that's why I'm stoked that we stoked on male-specific testosterone and really understanding that. And even then, I do feel like some women would get value listening to this. But I think my next question is really of all revolves around like kind of I know recently went on that trip and everything you said, you learned some new things. Is there anything that I didn't touch on or anything specifically that's in your mind right now that is like oh, this was a really cool thing I learned, or this was really fascinating, or um, yeah, anything testosterone related that I didn't touch on that you feel like is worth sharing, uh, and can be valuable for people listening.
Speaker 2:Yeah, definitely, and it's slightly controversial, but we'll we'll go into it.
Speaker 1:I love it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the whole idea of TRT, right, testosterone replacement therapy it's all the rage these days and everyone who is on it or thinking about it thinks it's like a miracle pill, think it's the next best thing, but it's really not. There's people that do it and I'm in these like TRT support groups and stuff just to keep my finger on the pulse and there's people posting every day about issues that they're experiencing, like their blood markers are off, they have to donate blood. They're you know, just not you know. Maybe they felt great two weeks in, but now they don't feel good, and so there's a lot of like variants and why. That is One. The main point that I want to get across is just like it's a bandaid.
Speaker 2:We talked about conventional medicine and that whole approach. You're addressing symptoms. You're not addressing the root cause. You're not addressing why do you have low testosterone in the first place. Look at that and then, if you've tried everything that you can think of, then maybe it is a good idea to hop on trt. Or, if you know, you're just in the depths of despair and things are really really, really bad, like maybe it's a means to an end and then you get off, but there's a lot of negative impacts as well. There's like fertility impacts if you're on trt and you're trying to conceive. There can be issues there which I feel like doesn't get talking about that much.
Speaker 2:And then also, which I think is really funny, is the carrier oils that are used to inject with are seed oils most of the time. So someone can be very into their health and like, oh, I avoid seed oils, but they're on TRT and they didn't check, or they some people check, but it's like cotton seed oil is a big one, sesame oil I forget the other one but they're essentially injecting. Corn oil, I think is used as well, and you're like why you wouldn't even eat that, but you're injecting that shit into your body. It's wild. So that's that's like a funny little tidbit that not many people know or talk about, which I think is silly.
Speaker 2:And then another crazy thing. These are really fringe things, but essentially if you're using a needle going through a rubber or a plastic vial, the needle that you're using this is very obscure, so take it with a grain of salt. Very obscure, so take it with a grain of salt. But you're puncturing with the needle through like plastic or rubber, and then there's a possibility that some of that rubber can be in the needle as you inject. So you might be injecting, like rubber, plastic microplastics into your body as well. Very fringe, like I wouldn't worry too much about that, but that's something that I learned on this trip that I was like didn't even think about that. But yeah, the main thing is like it's a bandaid and you're possibly not addressing the root cause and that could lead you to not get the results that you want.
Speaker 1:I've always had an interesting perspective on that and I mean, personally, I've never wanted to take any performance enhancing drugs. I never have. I've never wanted to For many of those reasons of like, when I was really getting into lifting, just doing my homework and research and reading into it and understanding my building, because obviously, like, when you start wanting to get big, you go look up bodybuilders and I was like so fascinated but I was like that just seems like such an irresponsible and dangerous thing to do as such a young man for myself personally. And so I was like I absolutely do not want to do that. And I have a very similar perspective in terms of like, okay, clients have asked me about that in the past and I've always recommended we need to dial everything else in first. If we do the sleep, we get the stress levels lower, we manage your nutrition, we dial in your micronutrients. We do all of that first. Only then, if you are still seeing bad symptoms, should we even consider that.
Speaker 1:And I just feel like too often people are going to looking for that shortcut, that quick fix. And I mean it's the same with people's diets, man. They're like, oh, I want to lose weight. Like what's the pill, what's the injection, what's the what's? What should I go do to? It's like now, like there's so many other things we got to do, and look at first before we try to just take the shortcut because you're not fixing the actual problem, you know. So, yeah, I think that's a great one. I thought it was a fantastic show. I don't think that's controversial one bit, to be honest opinion. But uh, hopefully we pissed a few people off there. But um, aside from that, was there any other interesting testosterone tips, hacks or anything else top of mind?
Speaker 2:sure let's uh, let's go fringe again. So this is this is more so for fertility. But, like you know, fertility and testosterone are tightly, tightly joined and this is anecdotal. But icing, icing your testicles has been shown to increase sperm count. So, like, fertility is definitely improved.
Speaker 2:Anecdotally, people report like like they do it either before going to sleep or like before the gym, and if they do it before the gym, like they're feeling like really, really strong, like they got a boost. So this is like taking you're not, you're not just like taking the ice cube putting it on your balls, like in a bag, or like not directly, just making sure the that they're, they're cool, because you know our balls are outside of our body for a reason it's because they operate at a much lower temperature. So that's that's playing with that idea of like cooling them off so they can function a lot better. And if you think about most guys, like wearing boxers, boxer briefs it's very tight, so that creates more heat. And then, coming back to the polyester, like if it's tight, hot, sweaty, you're getting more and more microplastics into into your ball.
Speaker 2:Not a great picture, but but yeah, that's like a fringe one that. Yeah, I've tried. I haven't done it too long but I felt it was interesting. But a lot of other anecdotes, that of people that really like that. But caveat and like clarification it's it has been shown to help with fertility and not directly testosterone, but there might be, like anecdotally, testosterone Okay.
Speaker 1:That actually kind of brought up something in my head which was ice baths and sauna. Are there anything and sauna? Are there anything, any data that you know of correlating to increased testosterone or better hormone production with those two, and is there any detriments to our testosterone or hormone production with sauna and or cold plunge?
Speaker 2:yeah. So studies of sauna and cold plunge on testosterone not very robust growth hormone, though for sauna, definitely super cool. And then, from like an indirect impact, sauna is very detoxifying. So if you have a lot of toxins, if you detox them, you're going to be a lot, you're going to function a lot better. So indirectly, I think, definitely benefits.
Speaker 2:Coming back to the temperature thing like with the sauna, you're getting very hot, could possibly cause some issues with testosterone production because your body's getting hot, so your balls are getting hot as well. I wouldn't avoid sauna just because of that, though Some people are extra and they go to the sauna and they have an ice pack on their balls. So if you want to do that, then go for it. Ice baths same type of thing I think they're great, but in terms of where they can be, not beneficial is if you're just crazy stressed, if you're overly stressed, because these two things they're stressors, they're viewed as you stress, which is like good stress, but if you're at like peak cortisol, if you're just like burning the candle at both ends sauna, cold plunge it might push you over and make you, you know, actually harm you.
Speaker 2:So this is where the nuance comes in, like everyone's talking about cold plunges and sauna being amazing, but like we have to check in with you what are your stress levels like? Can you handle it? Is it going to push you over the edge? How do you feel after it? We're all good then, like yeah, I don't see why not fantastic.
Speaker 1:I'm glad I got those ones in because I was actually curious to hear your perspective on those. I I sauna 40 minutes at like 150 once a week, as well as a. I'm working my way up. I'm still kind of a chicken, but I do. It's like 41 or 42 degrees. I'll go in the cold plunge for like three to five minutes, depending on how much of a man I'm feeling that day, but it does do that never gets easier, dude, cold plunge is just brutal. And the only other weird one that I thought of is like if you're just sunning your balls, um, yeah, the sunlight, what's your? Uh, what's your?
Speaker 2:take on. Yeah, I've, I've kind of been talking shit about it just because it's. It's just like it's kind of fringe.
Speaker 2:It's like silly, it's anecdotal but it is kind of backed in in theory like the scrotum has a large, large portion of vitamin d receptors. So you know, I've never personally tried it, it could be, could be cool, I could be missing out, but I've just haven't had the opportunity to. I can't really speak too much on that, but I tend to just like poke fun at it because, like, if you really want to optimize your testosterone, do all this stuff that we've been talking about and then maybe, like at the 0.1, if you want really want to take it to the next level, like start that yeah speaking of weird stuff like that.
Speaker 1:Definitely one I've tried is I have a red light yeah, I really have you heard of juve, the company juve?
Speaker 1:yeah, I have one of, like the go one. You know, when I'm dialed in sometimes I'll just, you know, once a week or a couple of days a week sat shatted on my nuts and you know, hopefully get some testosterone boosting effects from that. But yeah, man, definitely. It's funny to see all the random and outlandish stuff that people do to increase their testosterone while they're getting three hours of sleep at night and not eating like an asshole constantly.
Speaker 1:It's like you have way bigger rocks. You need to move like an asshole constantly. It's like, bro you have way bigger rocks you need to move. So, last but not least, man, I do have one really awesome question for you, and that is if you could only teach your clients one skill or habit that would have the single greatest impact on their health and quality of life, what?
Speaker 2:would it be.
Speaker 2:That's a good one. I want to try and not like what immediately comes out is sleep, like learn how to sleep, well, um, but I also I want to take it further and and learn how to run that. N equals one experiment. So not just like taking what everyone does and use it as the bible, but really like if you're doing something, really being intentional with it and tapping in and being like how is this affecting me? How is this affecting my energy? Blah, blah, blah. How is this affecting me in general? And then being able to start to make decisions based off of that. So you can like eggs. I read an article that said eggs is the best food in the world, but when you eat eggs, you don't feel that great and you're like caught in between oh, but it's supposed to be a great food. What's wrong? Having that awareness and that understanding to be like it might not be for me and trying other things, that's where I would go. So you can call that, like I don't know, bio-individuality regulation, if we'll give it a name.
Speaker 2:I like that, something like that, to just yeah, like use the feedback as a learning opportunity.
Speaker 1:I think what came to my mind was just the word pay attention.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Pay attention right, yeah, it's just pay attention to like the feedback that you're getting, pay attention to the signs and signals, like it's so amazing how our bodies are such complex machines but oftentimes they give us the littlest and minute details that if you really pay attention to it, it's like I have this cool aura ring that I'm always wearing. But if I just really paid attention, like how do I feel when I wake up? Well, I felt like shit. So what did I do the day before? Oh, maybe I was on my phone until 12 at night. Okay, maybe that's what I should stop, you know.
Speaker 1:So pay attention and also this is why I love journaling or writing down, like in the morning or at night, like how did you feel that day, what things came to mind or how was your digestion that day, like noting down these things and paying attention to them, finding signs and patterns is so amazing for the body. So that question I just asked you is part of the Taught Not Told podcast tradition. That's my company's Taught Not Told, that's my brand. It's about teaching people instead of telling them what to do. I did an amazing job at teaching people about their health, about their hormones, about testosterone, and I cannot wait to share this with people.
Speaker 1:And, last but not least, man, I want everyone listening to this to go follow Mark on Instagram and I want them to please go shoot him a message and thank him for all this amazing information, because I know you got a ton of value from this. But aside from that, mark, where can people find you? What is the best way to reach out to you if people are interested in learning about hormones or wanting to get that test? I'll add all of this to the description, by the way, so you can go tap below to find me. But yeah, what's the best way to?
Speaker 2:connect with you man.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Best way is on Instagram. Mark Holman Health Super simple, perfect man.
Speaker 1:Well, mark, thank you again for your time. Thank you so much for coming on today. I thoroughly enjoyed this. I learned so much, including that pomegranate tip Dude that was phenomenal.
Speaker 2:I'll send you the study.
Speaker 1:Sweet dude. Thank you so much again. I really appreciate your time and look forward to connecting with you again soon man.
Speaker 2:Yeah, of course it's awesome, Alrighty Peace.
